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Otome games?!

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Started 2 years ago by masuto
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caddyalan
Member

I'm glad that the Aksys staff created a second part of the survey. So I made sure to say my part, such as...

* I am sometimes willing to pay for limited edition extras. But I also like inexpensive games. So whether a title is released on retail shelves or just digital copies, having a choice is a good thing.

* I feel that since romance games and visual novels are a tiny niche in game/anime-manga fandom, it might be challenging to sell a game at brick and mortar retailers and succeed. So I chose the following platforms: Windows, PSN (as in paid PSP download), iOS, and XBLA. I know other individuals and companies have found success selling their niche products through Steam, iTunes, and XBox Live Arcade. Also, I know of two otome visual novels currently available in English on iTunes US: "Ren'ai Shugi Road to Emerald" and "Pinky Distortion."

* Finally, I know that dubbing is an expensive process. To reduce expenses and risks, perhaps the Aksys staff might want to forego it. After all, NIS America released the relatively niche titles Atelier Annie (DS) and Muramasa (Wii) with only the original Japanese dialogue.

Hawk_hotlips said:
I personally think that going into visual novels in general, not just Otome games, would be pretty nice...

That makes sense to me. I'm interested in VNs regardless of setting or premise. And I'm glad that some fans and companies are creating a few in English which can't be classified as harem or reverse harem games. On the other hand, few visual novels include complex gameplay. Even the most Serious Business story can be a tough sell to fans who expect action or strategy in their games. So I believe they'd fit well on platforms where non-traditional video games can succeed.

Posted 2 years ago #
Hawk_hotlips
Member

Actually, Muramasa was published by Ignition. Not NISA.

Posted 2 years ago #
masuto
Member

Good suggestions caddyalan. I also would like an LE. What about those bento lunch box those Japanese students bring to school? I think that would be pretty awesome to have a bento box as an LE for an otome games. Also, sub or dub, I 'd still prefer dub.

Posted 2 years ago #
Quillbell
Member

Thank you Aksys for doing this survey. I'm glad that someone is finally considering bringing over Otome games. There are very few games that are made with girls in mind that aren't complete -your mother is a classy lady-, and it's nice to think that this neglected genre will finally be brought to the english market. I'm a big fan of almost any game that allows me to play as my own gender (love ya Bioware) and/or doesn't assume I'm a guy, which is still very rare.

As for the whole platform issue; I'd release them on PSN and allow them to be played on poth ps3 and psp, in order to reach a wider audience. Plus I find that, like Walmart, the PSN is very prone to eliciting impulse buys (though it may be just me).

Savvy said:
Ask any lady fan of Knights of the Old Republic about Carth, and most won't be able to tell you who the voice actor was. But damn if they don't swoon at the sound of his voice.

Raphael Sbarge. And no I didn't have to look that up. ;)

Posted 2 years ago #
Savvy
Member

Quillbell said:
Raphael Sbarge. And no I didn't have to look that up. ;)

I actually knew his name too, but most players don't quite reach that level of fangirlyness. :)

But still, though I love the guy's voice, I wouldn't buy a game just because he's in it. I actually found it kind of jarring to hear his voice coming out of Kaiden in Mass Effect, since I already associate it with Carth. It pulled me out of the game a bit.

Also, I really hope any otome game released in America, should that ever come to pass, isn't a digital only release. Not only is the potential market much smaller, but because I would kill for a LE, no matter what the game is.

Case in point: I wasn't going to buy Fable III for a while because it comes out right after Fallout New Vegas, and I plan on having that game dominate my free time for a while. So I figured I would pick up Fable III once the price went down. Then they announced the Limited Edition. I couldn't help preordering the bundle after that, even though I probably won't even touch the game itself for at least a month after its release. And yes, I also have the Collectors Edition of Fallout New Vegas preordered.

My name is Savvy, and I have a problem.

Posted 2 years ago #
Hawk_hotlips
Member

Personally, I wonder how Aksys would market Otome games? If they're going to go a similar route like with Record of Agarest War, they might as well just say that "THIS IS THE COMPETITOR TO FEEL THE MAGIC!" and go with that crowd.

Posted 2 years ago #
Wastrel
Member

It's never a good sign when someone registers to rant, is it? Just couldn't take the idea of Akysys wasting (in my opinion) resources on an otome game without at least trying to make my case. I promise I'm not usually this belligerent. >_>

Alright! Three points to start off with:

1) I am a girl
2) I have played entirely too many visual novels
3) My attitude towards otome games falls somewhere between dislike and outright loathing

Visual novels are a surprisingly powerful medium, with both the subtle complexity of prose and the raw power of music and visuals; the emotional equivalent of being simultaneously poisoned and bludgeoned over the head with a guitar. Umineko once trapped me between tears and nausea, making me feel like I was about to choke on my own despair, Sunflower Girl had characters that felt truly human, Inganock had prose with the cadence of poetry, and Cross Channel...Cross Channel broke me, there's no going back from that.

So why the hell would I want to waste all that potential by curling up into a tiny ball and waiting for some dude with flowing hair and a face like a 14 year old super model to come save me? Otome games are, for the most part, sexist. Using that term feels a bit...off as within the context of the world, the way the player is treated usually DOES make sense (i.e a Princess would be fawned over and protected), but the scenarios themselves play to such stereotypically and, more importantly, boring female fantasies that just hearing about them can make me facepalm so hard my nose bleeds. Otome games coddle you, they never make you hurt or fear or love.

Given the choice, I do prefer to play my own gender in games. It feels better, more natural, that way. But it's not like Aksys would have to translate an otome game to give us a female lead, even within the visual novel genre. Here, check out the description for Shikkoku no Sharnoth:

"The year is 1905 in the capital of the British Empire, the Steam City London, where the air is so thick with smoke that a mere glimpse of the blue sky is considered a miracle. The protagonist, Mary Clarissa Christie [Agatha Christie], is a girl living by herself while her mother works abroad. She attends university with her friends, Angelica Derleth and Charlotte Bronte, and lives a peaceful life.

However, through a chance encounter, she finds herself drawn into another side of London- spoken of only as rumours of "Meta Critters" who roam the night and attack people. She forms a contract with a strange man in a black suit, known as 'The M', and begins to help him hunt these creatures..."

Doesn't that sound better than clothes shopping and flirting with shallow, personality devoid boys? :3

Posted 2 years ago #
Quillbell
Member

@Wastrel: Nah ranting's okay as long as it's on topic.

I don't pretend to know a whole lot about individual Otome games (why torture myself if I'm never going to be able to play them), but I'd hope Aksys would choose to bring over the cream of the crop, so to speak. I also love visual novels, and it's not inconceivable that an Otome game could have a really good plot, just look at Bishoujo games like Fate/Stay Night. At the end of the day, no, I won't play an Otome game if it isn't a "good game", but out of the entire genre I'm sure there are those that would be worth playing.

By the way Shikkoku no Sharnoth sounds awesome.

Posted 2 years ago #
Savvy
Member

@Wastrel: Well it's good to know you consider putting money in any game that doesn't specifically cater to your tastes a waste of resources. That certainly puts things into perspective.

Look, I hate trashy derivative stuff too, but I'm not going to complain about the people who are into that sort of stuff. If it gets more girls into gaming in the first place then that's a good thing. They can graduate to the "real" games later. And even if they don't, it's just their personal preference, certainly not a fault.

Honestly this almost sounds like the kind of contempt hardcore gamers have towards the casual. But plenty of people don't want a huge moving experience or an 80 hour epic when they pick up a game, and they never will. But if they did, whose to say that an otome game can't give that to them? Can you seriously make such a broad sweeping statement about an entire genre?

Girls are never going to get over the idea that the gaming culture is for boys if that's all that ever gets released in America. And most games with a female protagonist do nothing to change that perspective. I freaking loved Bayonetta. I thought both the game and its star were awesome. But it was always made very clear that I wasn't supposed to identify with her. I was supposed to lust after her. And that's a huge barrier to a lot of ladies who might have otherwise been able to enjoy the game.

There's plenty wrong with a lot of otome games. But in here in America where the best games for girls available are about fashion and makeup, I for one would like the chance to play a girly game that at least has a story. Even if it's not the best story, it's a step in the right direction. And there's a lot of people that won't move unless they can take baby steps.

Posted 2 years ago #
Wastrel
Member

@Savvy
But an otome game is a game that caters to girls in the same way games like Dead or Alive Volleyball cater to dudes -- they can be fun but they're ultimately shallow and somewhat insulting. What I'm trying to say is that otome games ARE a step in the wrong direction, that while games with strong female leads are brilliant, this is the opposite of what the games industry needs to reach gender equality. We're essentially being offered a chance to play house, complete with princess dress-up and while I'm certainty not opposed to the idea of games like that being translated (catch female gamers while they're young!), it doesn't belong in what appears to be a genuine effort on Aksys' part to reach out towards the average female gamer.

And the reason I make such sweeping statements is because goddammit I've tried. I've played games aimed at girls, otome included, and after hearing about how Aksys was considering localizing an otome game I dashed over to VNDB to see if there were any interesting titles...but I couldn't a single one. There were however quite a number of interesting games that had female protagonists, which seemed to be to be preferable anyway as they focused on story, not living out some Disney Princess fantasy.

But calling it a waste of resources was definitely too harsh of me, sorry! >_>

Also, for those of you here who ARE interested in otome games and want to try one of the classics out, TokimemoGS1 Translation has released a full patch for Tokimeki Memorial Girl's Side 1st Love Plus.

Posted 2 years ago #
veregna
Member

@Savvy +1

@Wastrel I can't make specific comments on what you're saying, since I have no idea what games you've tried.

What I can say, though, is that everything you've just said in your two posts can just as easily and equally be applied to generic visual novels or visual novels aimed at a male audience. IF you've played otome games in Japanese, I'll give you some leg room, but if not: I want to note that fan translated visual novels are of course going to be good in general, because who out there is going to waste time translating a -your mother is a classy lady- game? Of which there are hundreds out there. HUNDREDS.

There's a number of reasons why otome games typically don't get fan translations; the most prominent of which is the simple fact that otome games typically don't get released for the PC. How many EN patches for PS2 games have you seen around? Therefore, if you're a PC-only gamer when it comes to VNs, the sample size for otoge is already much smaller than any other VN genre.

ETA: I think it would be prudent to interpret Aksys' interest in otome games as less "a visual novel geared towards women" and more "a GAME geared towards women". Like how Agarest Senki is an SRPG that happens to involve a man romancing a woman-- perhaps Aksys is simply considering localizing a similar style of game, except one which involves a woman romancing a man. (They do exist. For example: Summon Night, an SRPG series in which you can choose the gender of the main character as well as choose a character ending, regardless of their gender ~~so if you're like me, you'll probably end up playing for the BL overtones anyway~~.)

Posted 2 years ago #
Retro
Member

The only otome VN that I've ever laid my hands on was Starry Sky in Spring. Some may know the Starry Sky series, it's the current darling among the otome community and even has an anime in the works. And to be frank, Spring was absolute bilge. The heroine had little to no redeeming or notable characteristics. It was made painfully obvious that she was essentially a self-insert, and the credits pretty much confirmed that. Understandably the whole affair left a sour taste in my mouth, and to be honest I've been hesitant about trying about other otome VNs. Lucky that I wasn't put off them entirely, though!

If you guys were to bring otome VNs, may I suggest that you bring over something with a little more substance to it? Something which doesn't just wholly rely on how dashing the lead hero is, or how many guys are fawning over the protagonist. If the average Jane Doe were to pick up an otome VN that Akys licensed in her usual game shop/saw it on Amazon or wherever, what would appeal to her? If it were something that looked like a stereotypical dating sim, she would probably raise her eyebrows and think that it's a little bit trashy/pandering. But if she were to pick up a title with a bit more teeth that doesn't overtly pander to her, (like Danzai no Maria, for example) she may think that she might like to try it.

But hey, there'll certainly be a crowd for whatever otome VN gets licensed. Akys' best bet would probably be to license something that already has an anime/substantial fanbase, like Hakuouki, for example. Hell, even the aforementioned Starry Sky might be the next big thing.

Posted 2 years ago #
Shadowfang12
Member

What the heck is an Otome game?

Don't shoot me!

Posted 2 years ago #
Snow
Member

Shadowfang12 said:
What the heck is an Otome game?

Don't shoot me!

Visual novel/dating sim targetted for female audience.

GT: SeethingL1ght
PSN: SeethingL1ght

Posted 2 years ago #
Quillbell
Member

@Retro: Well does anyone remember the games Aksys was asking about in their survey? Because those are probably the ones that they're considering. I totally agree with you about Danzai no Maria though, I even entered it into the "suggestions" box on the survey, let's hope Aksys listened.

Posted 2 years ago #
Shadowfang12
Member

Snow said:
Visual novel/dating sim targetted for female audience.

Thanks my friend!

But if a dating game targeted at women is called a Otome game then what is a dating game designated for men called?

This is quite the conundrum.

Posted 2 years ago #
Snow
Member

Shadowfang12 said:
Thanks my friend!

But if a dating game targeted at women is called a Otome game then what is a dating game designated for men called?

This is quite the conundrum.

That, my friend would be Gal game(or galge for short)/Bishoujo.

GT: SeethingL1ght
PSN: SeethingL1ght

Posted 2 years ago #
Shadowfang12
Member

Snow said:
That, my friend would be Gal game(or galge for short)/Bishoujo.

Dang.....how do you know this stuff?

Good thing I know smart people.

Posted 2 years ago #
Rogue Ninja
Member

Shadowfang12 said:
Dang.....how do you know this stuff?

Good thing I know smart people.

The intarwebs (and Google search) are your friends. ^_^

Can I not elicit even a sarcastic quip?

Posted 2 years ago #
Snow
Member

Shadowfang12 said:
Dang.....how do you know this stuff?

Good thing I know smart people.

I've read and watched several manga and anime that mentions this stuff. My curiousity helped fuel that along with google so yeah google is your friend. =/

GT: SeethingL1ght
PSN: SeethingL1ght

Posted 2 years ago #

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